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  1. #1
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    Question Unanswered: Auto-backup of db, prepared before naming it?

    A critical collection of databases is going to be transferred over an encrypted internet connection. We want each row backed up / copied to a second db on the local network immediately as it arrives. We also want to prepare this so that ANY number of DB's, anything put on the server is immediately backed up.

    Here's the question:
    We will perhaps not know all the db names... Is it possible to set Oracle 9 to auto-backup/replicate any new db onto a different location without specifying db names or how many dbs there are? I would also prefer to not have to connect to another oracle/db server for the backup, just put the data in a db from within the server in question, but on a separate disk/network share (as a file/file collection?)

    I do not know Oracle 9 or its file stucture etc., but would like to know how this can be done (what are relevant concerns) before I talk to the external people that will help doing this.

    Any comment/advice is highly appreciated.

  2. #2
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    Good luck!

    Oracle RMAN does not have a "backup new rows upon insert" command. Even the new block change tracking feature of RMAN 10g (for faster incremental backups) uses a buffered write, and is not real-time.

    Oracle Advanced Replication will do it, if setup in Synchronous Mode, but replication requires a lot of planning and setup for each database, so it might not meet your requirement to support "any number of DBs on the network." It's not plug and play.

    Checkout SharePlex from Quest. Similar to Oracle Standby with Data Guard, the Quest product monitors your redo logs for new entries and applies them to remote databases near-immediately.

    Also, if you are using EMC storage arrays, look at Symmetric Data Replication Facility (SRDF). It uses disk block replication, so a block cannot be written locally unless it is also written remotely. EMC also has two async modes (one has ordered writes, the other has unordered writes), but I don't like either of them for production databases.
    MarkRem
    Author, Oracle Database 10g: From Nuts to Soup
    http://www.remidata.com/book_nuts2soup.htm

  3. #3
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    Cool

    Maybe we need some definitions/clarification here:

    What do you mean by:

    1)"A critical collection of databases" -- Define database.
    2) "is going to be transferred" -- How (SFTP?, SCP?)
    3) What will be transfered: The Database files?
    4) "We want each row backed up / copied to a second db" -- Each row? Second DB?
    5) "so that ANY number of DB's, anything put on the server is immediately backed up." -- Depends on what you will be transfering.
    The person who says it can't be done should not interrupt the person doing it. -- Chinese proverb

  4. #4
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    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by LKBrwn_DBA
    Maybe we need some definitions/clarification here:
    What do you mean by:
    1)"A critical collection of databases" -- Define database.
    2) "is going to be transferred" -- How (SFTP?, SCP?)
    3) What will be transfered: The Database files?
    4) "We want each row backed up / copied to a second db" -- Each row? Second DB?
    5) "so that ANY number of DB's, anything put on the server is immediately backed up." -- Depends on what you will be transfering.
    First, I do not know oracle, I am hoping to get to know if it is possible so that I can insist that the tecnical people will look to find such a solution. Please dont give me any comments like "then you are dealing with incompetent people" or the like. We have a strange situation here, and I only need to know what I can insist on being investigated as a possible solution.

    1) A third-party oracle solution is being transferred inhouse over the internet, and we need to ensure that we gain full control of the product. It is a collection of oracle databases with a framework programmed using delphi. I do not know the technicalities.
    2) "is going to be transferred" -- How :
    - transfer method is irrelevant here.

    3) What will be transfered: either a db export from one system to be imported into the new server once the files are copied, or a direct db-link of some kind. To be decided. Also irrelevant for the question I need to find the answer for quickly.

    4) "We want each row backed up / copied to a second db" -- Each row? Second DB?
    - If a db-link will be the way to transfer the data: I would like to know if we can set up oracle to automatically replicate/back up anything new that comes into the system, even when MAKING a new DB, I want it instantly backed up "invisibly". Possible or not?

    5) "so that ANY number of DB's, anything put on the server is immediately backed up." -- Depends on what you will be transfering.
    - see 4) can we make sure that anything new within the oracle server is instantly backed up? Incremented. So that if something is created, then modified, then deleted, we can get back each of the steps from a backup, enabling ourselves to step back to any part of the process?

    Related question I just posted:
    Can oracle admins be effectively blocked from full db access?
    http://www.dbforums.com/showthread.p...07#post4169407
    Win-XP pro, Access 2002, ADO 2.7, DAO 3.6. English versions of apps/OS.

  5. #5
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    Cool

    In order to implement any solution, you need to know Oracle.
    To do what you want, here are some solutions:

    1) Export/(sftp or scp)/Import (easy but cumbersome).
    2) Standby database -- needs person with knowledge.
    3) Oracle Advanced Replication -- needs person with knowledge.

    There are many other solutions including third party utilities.
    The person who says it can't be done should not interrupt the person doing it. -- Chinese proverb

  6. #6
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    Provided Answers: 1
    Quote Originally Posted by kedaniel
    First, I do not know oracle, I am hoping to get to know if it is possible so that I can insist that the tecnical people will look to find such a solution.
    So, you don't trust judgment of your own "technical people"; instead, you ask vague questions on an internet board and then "insist" your personnel should implement something that anonymous "experts" suggest... I surely wouldn't want to work for you.

  7. #7
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    Provided Answers: 1
    Nothing is impossible for the person who does not actually have to make it work!
    IMO, you'll find the Holy Grail or the Golden Fleece before you deploy a techincal solution that meets all your "design requirements".
    You can lead some folks to knowledge, but you can not make them think.
    The average person thinks he's above average!
    For most folks, they don't know, what they don't know.
    Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.

  8. #8
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    There will be issues using an Oracle solution to your problem, or any database-centric solution, because of the dynamic nature of your problem. All database-centric solutions need to be configured separately for each database. Since you do not know how many databases, it's obviously impossible to assume you can configure all of them ahead of time. This rules out things like Oracle Standby Database and Quest SharePlex.

    What you want is something that captures the disk block changes, like EMC SRDF. It then does not matter what is running on your server because a block is a block, and you never have to reconfigure when you create or drop databases because all the monitor needs to know is "a disk block was changed." When you look at the remote server you see your new database has been magically created. Of course, this only applied to the mirrored drives. If you do not mirror the boot drive, then anything you do there (such as registry changes or setting processes to autostart) will need to be manually setup on the remote server.

    The list of available products that satisfy such requirements are specific to your hardware vendor. I think HP's is called FalconStar. Just do a Google for Remote Mirroring.
    MarkRem
    Author, Oracle Database 10g: From Nuts to Soup
    http://www.remidata.com/book_nuts2soup.htm

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